VFAT 2007

Rhino · Post by **Rhino** » Mon May 28, 2007 8:39 pm

Streaming the event in my opinion would be a Paul Bunyan size step in the right direction. It would open up the event to so many more people. I have talked to real world pilots and some in the airshow business, who have said that if they didn't have to buy the game and all that and could watch the show, they would. Again, I think we would need to have 2 streams running........one in the US and one for Europe.

This could turn into something major. Lets see that it happens.

Post by **Lawndart** » Mon May 28, 2007 8:47 pm

If streaming is at all possible, the "camera men" need to read up on each team's maneuvers and sequence, so we don't suffer the same fate as the live streams from real air shows this year that had horrible camera men, with no idea what was going on!?

In other words, whomever is actually in the server recording the stream needs to know the show and what to expect from each demo!

Of course, making tracks available afterwards, like last year, is an awesome bonus and would make up for some of the lost views (or missed maneuvers) in a live stream. Plus, the true fans (or movie makers) get what they want too!

Tomcatboy48237 · Post by **Tomcatboy48237** » Mon May 28, 2007 9:47 pm

Rhino wrote:Streaming the event in my opinion would be a Paul Bunyan size step in the right direction. It would open up the event to so many more people. I have talked to real world pilots and some in the airshow business, who have said that if they didn't have to buy the game and all that and could watch the show, they would. Again, I think we would need to have 2 streams running........one in the US and one for Europe.

This could turn into something major. Lets see that it happens.

I'm in that group. I won't be getting on LOMAC to watch but if you can stearm it or make a movie of it for download after the fact, I'll be sure to check it out!

Frazer · Post by **Frazer** » Tue May 29, 2007 2:14 am

Lawndart wrote:If streaming is at all possible, the "camera men" need to read up on each team's maneuvers and sequence, so we don't suffer the same fate as the live streams from real air shows this year that had horrible camera men, with no idea what was going on!?

In other words, whomever is actually in the server recording the stream needs to know the show and what to expect from each demo!

Of course, making tracks available afterwards, like last year, is an awesome bonus and would make up for some of the lost views (or missed maneuvers) in a live stream. Plus, the true fans (or movie makers) get what they want too!

I don't think getting a good camera man is the biggest problem

But we really need to start early with organizing this year if we want to make a live stream possible. Maybe we can ask ED, Thrustmaster or Saitek to sponsor us?
I think putting the tracks up right after the show will be even with a live stream a good thing to do.

Post by **Lawndart** » Tue May 29, 2007 2:37 am

Having a world wide event makes more sense; however, given the mod limitations and ping across the Atlantic, having (at least) two, if not three mods and three different regional servers to divide up VFAT is smart! Here are a few reasons why!

Having European and North American teams using different mods.
Possibly one mod for each server for easier identification of which mod to use, allowing teams to choose the regional server closest to them and reducing the number of FM conflicts in each mod. (Most F-15 FM teams are in the states anyway and there are already two servers available here ready for use - VBA & VTB).
Server switch means mod switch (when would depend on time zone and region... see below).
Time zones; having European and North American flying take place during their own primetime. European flying would begin first since the sun comes up first over there, and American teams start later, but not overlap each other. This simply means that everyone in Europe performs during the same time for them as the American teams do over here, since we are anywhere from 5-8 hours behind in time difference. The only real sacrifice is for people in US wanting to see European teams, they would need to get up earlier and for people in Europe wanting to see American teams would need to stay up late. (Heck, we already knew it would be a long day anyway right!). The good news is that for each performer they get to fly during normal day hours regardless of where in the world!

Having one mod per server and having an order in which the servers are used could be one sollution. Example: JaBoG server flies first with most European teams, then VTB server with additional teams and lastly the VBA server with additional teams. Each server with it's own mod to use and not overlapping show programs with the other regions, so that everyone can switch mod(s) and server at the same time.

Just some ideas...

Frazer · Post by **Frazer** » Tue May 29, 2007 6:38 am

Lawndart wrote:Having a world wide event makes more sense; however, given the mod limitations and ping across the Atlantic, having (at least) two, if not three mods and three different regional servers to divide up VFAT is smart! Here are a few reasons why!
Having European and North American teams using different mods.
Possibly one mod for each server for easier identification of which mod to use, allowing teams to choose the regional server closest to them and reducing the number of FM conflicts in each mod. (Most F-15 FM teams are in the states anyway and there are already two servers available here ready for use - VBA & VTB).
Server switch means mod switch (when would depend on time zone and region... see below).
Time zones; having European and North American flying take place during their own primetime. European flying would begin first since the sun comes up first over there, and American teams start later, but not overlap each other. This simply means that everyone in Europe performs during the same time for them as the American teams do over here, since we are anywhere from 5-8 hours behind in time difference. The only real sacrifice is for people in US wanting to see European teams, they would need to get up earlier and for people in Europe wanting to see American teams would need to stay up late. (Heck, we already knew it would be a long day anyway right!). The good news is that for each performer they get to fly during normal day hours regardless of where in the world!
Having one mod per server and having an order in which the servers are used could be one sollution. Example: JaBoG server flies first with most European teams, then VTB server with additional teams and lastly the VBA server with additional teams. Each server with it's own mod to use and not overlapping show programs with the other regions, so that everyone can switch mod(s) and server at the same time.

Just some ideas...

Sounds good to me!

Post by **Lawndart** » Tue May 29, 2007 8:50 am

Frazer wrote:Maybe we can ask ED, Thrustmaster or Saitek to sponsor us?

Can always ask... but we need to fill in a few Q-marks first!

If granted, we could possibly get funds needed to rent equipment, or bandwidth over the weekend and would need in return have advertising on the URL for the event not to include any competitor of TM. I'm not speaking on behalf of TM here, but just to give you an idea how that would work if asked for...

It wouldn't solve the problems of streaming itself! That would still be up to us to figure out; how to accomplish and what we need! So, let's keep working on that first! ...unless any of the other names you mentioned already have a working streaming sollution in place ready to use?!

Racer · Post by **Racer** » Tue May 29, 2007 9:50 am

This looks like a interesting link for streaming info.
http://www.mediacollege.com/video/streaming/server.html

Rhino · Post by **Rhino** » Tue May 29, 2007 5:29 pm

I think that we need to get a few teams together on this, i.e. sit down and have a meeting somewhere and discuss some arrangements. Kind of like a VFAT pre-registration meeting. Any team that wishes to participate would need to send just 1 representative so we could meet.

Post by **Lawndart** » Wed May 30, 2007 12:40 pm

We prolly can't get all teams wishing to participate to meet, but definitely the host(s) and a representative from whomever is already following this discussion here.

I'll get JaBoG on the line first and we'll figure out a meeting time within the coming weeks.

Topics, please add your own...

2/3 Servers?
Mod(s)
Streaming
Show schedule (w/ multiple servers)
Preliminary suggestions for show site, if other than Razdolnoye?

Tailhook · Post by **Tailhook** » Wed May 30, 2007 3:05 pm

mission additions and firepower

mission addition- carrier off shore?
firepower- ability to shoot cannon at ground?

Rhino · Post by **Rhino** » Wed May 30, 2007 6:29 pm

Who will fly on what server would be a question to ask. For instance, I can see on the American side, using the VTB and the VBA servers (they are probably in the same server block believe it or not

) and then assigning the various remaining US teams to our respective servers.

Also, again, this is a Virtual Festival of Aerobatic Teams, not the M61 Vulcan convention, so a no to the guns in my mind.

As far as the carrier, we utilize Razdol'ne for our show base, which is pretty close to water, so if you did want to put a carrier out there I guess that would be ok to stage from.

Show site wise, I can't think of using any other place than Razdolnoye. N-S runway and no frills frame wise.

Post by **Lawndart** » Wed May 30, 2007 9:32 pm

As long as we split up the "powerhouse F-15 FM" - users between the servers, we should be fine (assuming a mod per server)! I think it's too early to divide any teams yet, since the preliminary registration hasn't even taken place, although splitting up the teams using the most number of F-15 FM now is a start...

Razdolnoye is almost tradition for VFAT (going strong on 2 years!

). The VTB are used to flying shows anywhere with odd cardinals such as 162/342 or 058/238 show lines, so that wouldn't be a problem from our end; however, for tradition's sake I'd vote for Razdolnoye as the site and limited number of 3D objects aside from the performers jets. Having cardinals off of 180/360 makes no difference to me, but I agree it's easier for those not used to anything else!

Kato · Post by **Kato** » Wed May 30, 2007 10:46 pm

Relative to the "mods" part of this discussion, I have found a way to reduce, if not eliminate the need multiple mods. With the new ED tools it is possible to have several teams fly the F-15 cockpit and flight model without changing mods. The same could apply for the other aircraft types.

Below is an example of how this might look using the single seat and 2 seat VBA jets, which themselves are different models. Both are selectable from the colour scheme menu.

To do this for teams at VFAT I will need your 3DS Max file (or .3ds file) assuming most teams have made a new Jet for their team. If you don't have a new jet, then I think it can still be done, as long as the aircraft file is in .lom format (.cmd won't work). If you have no idea what I just said, then don't worry - the guys who make the team's mods should understand)!!!

There is, of course, a catch... Each of the teams will have to load their own "server.lua" file to put the pilot's viewpoint in the correct location for their jet. Spectators won't need to worry, since they won't be in any jets to worry about exact head locations.

Here are a couple pics illustrating the principle. I just threw a few VTB slots and a few VSB slots in to the list (I'm pretty sure the VSB's don't use the F-15, but I wanted to show what it could look like):
The 1 Jet...

The 7 Jet...

Rotorblade · Post by **Rotorblade** » Wed May 30, 2007 10:55 pm

Very cool Kato, you are a true wizard.

I saw a picture in your forums with the 2 seater in a diamond surrounded by single seaters and knew you had something up your sleeve.

What if someone doesn't have access to the 3ds file, can it still be done as long as it is an .lom file?

Talk about exciting!