The Raptor Rocks

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Lawndart
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The Raptor Rocks

Post by Lawndart » Sun Sep 03, 2006 9:12 pm

F-22s treat airshow fans to a maneuverability demo.

http://www.airspacemag.com/issues/2006/ ... raptor.php
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Post by Tomcatboy48237 » Sun Sep 03, 2006 9:22 pm

It's scheduled for a flyby here at Cleveland tomorrow, can't wait!

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Post by Rhino » Mon Sep 04, 2006 12:05 am

A couple of things I can infer from that,

1. If he said they can get from Langley to Oshkosh (800 miles) in 25-30 minutes in SUPERCRUISE, that means, if i do the math right, thats above 1,600 mph roughly. Please, correct me if im wrong, but that puts the thing past Mach 2 in super cruise! So what exactly can the thing do IF the CANS are LIT? Mach 3+? And there had to be a mid-air refuel at some point on the way back.

2. It sounds like this guy (Dozer) was flying this thing like an Extra. When you guys (VTB's) go to Aviation Nation can you please get some good video. The stuff on Steve's World is good, but I cant find a video of the "helicopter".

3. I shoulve gone to Oshkosh this year, and am kicking my self for not doing so.
:oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

4. Click on the link to the Dover Airshow poster. Looks like the Diamond in an Echelon with Boss on the bottom in right hand turn?

Here's the link-
http://public.dover.amc.af.mil/shared/m ... 01-044.jpg
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Post by Lawndart » Mon Sep 04, 2006 1:24 am

As for the validity of any information, take it all with a grain of salt. Just as what you see at the air shows, will most likely not even touch the true capability (and maneuverability) of the Raptor. Most of the time they only fly high-speed passes, but even the more elaborate shows (Oshkosh) certainly do not showcase its limitations by any stretch. As for the numbers: Time, speed and distance... It's all hearsay...

The Trail-Banana (Echelon Pass) you're looking at in the poster has Thunderbirds No. 1-4 flying (in order) with an offset Trail formation using deep stack with an echelon formation type turn (note difference between making echelon turns and wing turns) and the only reason for Boss appearing in the lower right corner of the picture is because of a complete optical illusion!!! That's the point of the this maneuver!
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Post by Rhino » Mon Sep 04, 2006 2:01 am

But, the official ACC demo does not start until 2008, so if they (Dozer's higher ups) are only letting him show these maneuvers, i can only imagine what he can do with that thing. All I can say, is that I'm glad my tax money is going towards something as awesome as this!
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Post by Rotorblade » Mon Sep 11, 2006 11:27 am

I will have a video posted in a day or so highlighting the two F-22 Raptors that showed up in Toronto for the CNE this year. It was sweet! to bad the weather stunk.
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Post by Airshow fan » Mon Sep 11, 2006 6:18 pm

"the Raptor treats airshow fans.."

Hey! I am the one and only Airshow fan. Who took my name?! lol
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Post by scooter » Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:19 pm

I was exteremly fortunate to attend the Titan's game on Sunday and was treated with 4 -22's from 1st Fighter Wing out of Langley. It was awesome!

Here is a "feature" article.

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Post by Rhino » Wed Oct 11, 2006 11:45 pm

Sorry to dig up an old thread, but I found this video today.

Check out around 1:30, neat new "stealthy" feature...

http://www.defencetalk.com/military_vid ... 061009.php
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Post by JZimms100 » Tue Oct 24, 2006 10:25 pm

Hey Rhino,

As Lawndart so expertly noted.... take all that with a grain of salt. A rule among fighter pilots you might want to keep in mind..... only 10% of any story being told actually has to be true :) You get my point. His comment was not meant to be taken and chopped up in scientific discussion. The Raptor's capabilities are awesome, and I think that is all we need to know at this point!

Good Luck!

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Post by Tailhook » Tue Oct 24, 2006 10:41 pm

Personally, I like the raptor and I have seen that sucka fly! I just gotta see what Ill do on the battlefield to get my judgement.
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Post by FALCON56 » Wed Oct 25, 2006 9:19 pm

I heard the Raptor is supposed to do a Demo out at Nellis.. Should be interesting.. i do hope they do the Cobra manuver... Saw it on a video.. Would like to see it in person....

The plane im not a fan of is the F-35... I since we have a great plan in the F-22 why try to out do it already?? Id say scrap the f-35 project and upgrade the f-16s and f-15s to be compatable with the F-22 in a Data link or some combat capable set up... Or just scarp the 35 to build more 22s'...
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Post by Rhino » Wed Oct 25, 2006 10:15 pm

The F-35 is more than just for the Air Force though.

From Wikipedia: (see I give my sources credit)
"The JSF program was created to replace various aircraft while keeping development, production, and operating costs down. This was pursued by building three variants of one aircraft, sharing 80% of their parts:

* F-35A, a conventional takeoff and landing (CTOL) variant slated to replace U.S. Air Force (USAF) F-16 Fighting Falcons and A-10 Thunderbolts, beginning in 2011.
* F-35B, a short-takeoff and vertical-landing (STOVL) variant slated to replace the U.S. Marine Corps (USMC) AV-8 Harrier IIs and F/A-18 Hornets, Royal Air Force (RAF) Harrier GR7/9s, and Royal Navy (RN) Sea Harriers, beginning in 2012.
* F-35C, a carrier-based variant slated to replace U.S. Navy (USN) F/A-18 Hornets (A/B/C/D variants only) beginning in 2012."

There is also an international buying phase for the JSF.
Again, from Wikipedia:

"The primary customers and financial backers are the United States and the United Kingdom. Eight other nations are also funding the aircraft's development and will decide in 2006 whether or not to purchase it. Total program development costs, less procurement, are estimated at over US$40 billion, of which the bulk has been underwritten by the United States.[3]

There are three levels of international participation. The United Kingdom is the sole 'Level 1' partner, contributing slightly over US$2 billion, about 10% of the development costs[3]. Level 2 partners are Italy, which is contributing US$1 billion, and the Netherlands, US$800 million. At Level 3 are Turkey, US$175 million; Australia, US$144 million; Norway, US$122 million; Denmark, US$110 million; and Canada, US$100 million. The levels generally reflect the financial stake in the program, the amount of technology transfer and subcontracts open for bid by national companies, and the priority order in which countries can obtain production aircraft. Israel and Singapore have also joined as Security Cooperative Participants."

So again, its more than just the air force, and even more than OUR own armed forces.

Also remember, a major problem that has dogged the Harrier program was FOD. I've seen a Harrier go down after a FOD suck first hand at an airshow about 15 years ago. Lets just hope that the folks at Lockheed have figured this one out.

Rhino

EDIT....I can not see the Air Force getting rid of the A-10. Maybe it will go to the Marines, but for what it is, its way too valuable an asset.
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Post by FALCON56 » Wed Oct 25, 2006 10:46 pm

I do agree it is more than just about our own Air force and military.. But I was looking at it through that own AF situation... I also agree that the A-10 is a great aircraft and can still do its job. No doubt about it... I do agree with the fact that the STOVL can be a problem when it comes to FOD... But I still dont think that its worth the money.... just my opinion... If other countries want it.. Go for it... I jsut think that what the USAF has in its invetory now it can handle its own...As for the Navy... I am a big fan of the departed F-14..Not only did the navy lose a great jet, but a missle in the Phoenix.... The Super Bug isnt bad.. just a modified version of the original.. Cant complain about that....I do think the USMC has relied on STOVL to much.. Passing up on better fighter aircraft... Like the A-10 for example.. That would definately provid the ai suppourt that there ground forces need.. I guess coulda shoulda woulda u know... only the future will tell how it all works out... take care buddy


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Post by Rhino » Thu Dec 21, 2006 2:54 am

Sorry to dig up an old thread, but watch "Dozer" rip it up over Atlantic City....UNREAL!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GG96wleqmrk

Did he do any of this at Nellis when you guys were there?
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