That takeoff is STEEP
http://stage6.divx.com/the-IDIOT/video/ ... ws-AFB-'97
USAF Thunderbirds Andrews AFB '97
USAF Thunderbirds Andrews AFB '97
In case you haven't seen this one before
That takeoff is STEEP
http://stage6.divx.com/the-IDIOT/video/ ... ws-AFB-'97
That takeoff is STEEP
http://stage6.divx.com/the-IDIOT/video/ ... ws-AFB-'97
Also check this movie out from the Itallian "Frecce Tricolori" aerobatic team. This is my favorite movie, period!!! Many cockpit footage, good quality, very well composed.
http://stage6.divx.com/user/WR211Frazer ... onale-2002
(since it takes very long to buffer this movie, it is best to download it instead, by clicking next to the play arrow)
http://stage6.divx.com/user/WR211Frazer ... onale-2002
(since it takes very long to buffer this movie, it is best to download it instead, by clicking next to the play arrow)
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Tailhook
- Virtual Thunderbird Alumnus
- Posts: 1052
- Joined: Tue Apr 04, 2006 3:17 pm
- Location: Baltimore, MD
I was there in 1997. The Thunderbirds have to takeoff steep everytime at Andrews AFB because when they roll their rolling in the direction towards the White House and Capital which is a very restricted airspace. For the airbase being right in the center of Washington DC, you have multiple national buildings around. I can imagine how many people get yelled at a day for crossing over closed airspace there.....let alone airline pilots landing at Dulles International, my god....the Pentagon is less than 5 miles away right across the river!
Yeah, if you come here to see them at Andrews its pretty cool to see...they take off and pull straight up like 80 degrees.
Yeah, if you come here to see them at Andrews its pretty cool to see...they take off and pull straight up like 80 degrees.
Sneaky Tailhook and his "fish stories" are back!Viper101 wrote:Yeah, if you come here to see them at Andrews its pretty cool to see...they take off and pull straight up like 80 degrees.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TM1HRr1JkJY
Thats more like a 45 degree angle. Thats from Andrews this year, taking off to the north, with the National Mall a little over 5 miles away from the base to the north and west. Its close, but its not THAT close. Plus, with the way "Hollywood" flies, I wouldn't be surprised if he goes outside 4 miles. Also, its restricted for CIVILIAN and COMMERCIAL aircraft, not military.
The other one MAYBE 70, but those are the old days (when they used to fly with wing overlap and were a lot "cooler" to watch). Here it is on youtube for those of you that keep locking up on stage 6.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhP44U64D7g
Good video Frazer! Unfortunately stage6 always freezes or starts buffering whenever i try watching anything on it, I guess thats the price you pay for things being "free". Thunderbirds are a lot easier to record due to the frequency range they use for the diamond. Blue Angels are all in the mil air range, and you have to have a good scanner for it.
We had a crew base in DCA (Reagan airport right on the Potomac river) a few years back and I flew in there regularily. Dulles is well outside the city. Want me to enlighten you on the airspace, distances and surroundings? 
The Thunderbirds did steep T/O's in the nineties up to 60 degree angles.
The Thunderbirds did steep T/O's in the nineties up to 60 degree angles.
Last edited by Lawndart on Wed Jul 11, 2007 9:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Multiple reasons I'm sure. Why they went to a more flat takeoff could have been simply one Boss to the next changing it up and/or timing reasons for the show. A steep takeoff gets the Diamond slow and close to the crowd as they clear. The Solos would then takeoff leaving a gap in time after the last Solo until the Diamond is back. The current show profile is so incredibly fast that there's hardly any "gap" between two maneuvers. The Boss needs to keep his potential energy high as well as enough distance to accelerate back inbound again. A steep takeoff wouldn't really allow for that tight of a show. Again, I'm just elaborating, but that could be one of many reasons...
Speaking of distance, "Hollywood" whiffers around 2-3nm from show center on the most "stretched" setups. With the Thunderbirds typically owning the airspace within a 5nm radius and up to 15K, he effectively only uses half of that in both horizontal and vertical distance from the crowd. Keepin' the show tight!
The quickness of today's show is what impresses me the most, even more than tight formations! This wasn't always the case with the Thunderbirds, but as far as their spacing goes nowadays, they are only approved to fly "stage 1" tight formations with no wing overlap. This is above the Boss' head and political to a high degree. Back in the nineties and early this decade they were approved for "stage 2" formations based on their show performance and grades throughout the year and it was the OpsO's call with the Boss. Not anymore...
Although, I have to applaud "Hollywood" for what he's done to the show without being granted "stage 2". It is so quick and action packed, that it pushes the Solos to the limits on being able to always be on time and manage to call clear before "Hollywood" is back. ~S!
Speaking of distance, "Hollywood" whiffers around 2-3nm from show center on the most "stretched" setups. With the Thunderbirds typically owning the airspace within a 5nm radius and up to 15K, he effectively only uses half of that in both horizontal and vertical distance from the crowd. Keepin' the show tight!
The quickness of today's show is what impresses me the most, even more than tight formations! This wasn't always the case with the Thunderbirds, but as far as their spacing goes nowadays, they are only approved to fly "stage 1" tight formations with no wing overlap. This is above the Boss' head and political to a high degree. Back in the nineties and early this decade they were approved for "stage 2" formations based on their show performance and grades throughout the year and it was the OpsO's call with the Boss. Not anymore...
Although, I have to applaud "Hollywood" for what he's done to the show without being granted "stage 2". It is so quick and action packed, that it pushes the Solos to the limits on being able to always be on time and manage to call clear before "Hollywood" is back. ~S!
This outta hammer home the airspace thing at Andrews show site for good!
P.S. I somehow missed the 80 degree angle comment last time around... ROFL!
P.P.S. Forgot to say Thanks Frazer for posting these clips in the first place! I'd have to say that today's Thunderbirds are "cleaner" though, even if not as tight.
P.S. I somehow missed the 80 degree angle comment last time around... ROFL!
P.P.S. Forgot to say Thanks Frazer for posting these clips in the first place! I'd have to say that today's Thunderbirds are "cleaner" though, even if not as tight.
Hi Guys,
I can tell that you won't get just "yelled at" for crossing P-56. At a minimum, you will get legally violated if not shot down. Emergency aircraft or not. I fly out of DCA all the time. Altitude restrictions for the airspace reaches to 18000' MSL. LD, correct me if I am wrong, TB's do not perform any of their show manuvers above 18k (maybe the Bombburst) so a steep climb has nothing to do with P-56. Lateral avoidance of the area should be their primary concern and I am sure they take that into consideration. ADW shares the same control zone as DCA under Potomic control so any manuvering by the TB's during the show would likely by directed by Potomic. I have flown out of IAD more than I care. That aerodrome is not even a factor.
In my Navy days, I was the airshow performer/Coordinator for the Azalea Festival airshow in Norfolk for 3 years and saw how the teams coordinated their shows. One of the primary concerns there was the operation of Norfolk International. Norfolk always continued to operate under normal conditions during the shows. The TB's/ Blue Angels just had to avoid the area laterally to maintain airspace discipline. Never was a problem there. Well....., with the exception of one time. That was an interesting situation but was quickly resolved. Don't want to discuss that.
Anyhoo, Just my 2 cent experience.
Metro
I can tell that you won't get just "yelled at" for crossing P-56. At a minimum, you will get legally violated if not shot down. Emergency aircraft or not. I fly out of DCA all the time. Altitude restrictions for the airspace reaches to 18000' MSL. LD, correct me if I am wrong, TB's do not perform any of their show manuvers above 18k (maybe the Bombburst) so a steep climb has nothing to do with P-56. Lateral avoidance of the area should be their primary concern and I am sure they take that into consideration. ADW shares the same control zone as DCA under Potomic control so any manuvering by the TB's during the show would likely by directed by Potomic. I have flown out of IAD more than I care. That aerodrome is not even a factor.
In my Navy days, I was the airshow performer/Coordinator for the Azalea Festival airshow in Norfolk for 3 years and saw how the teams coordinated their shows. One of the primary concerns there was the operation of Norfolk International. Norfolk always continued to operate under normal conditions during the shows. The TB's/ Blue Angels just had to avoid the area laterally to maintain airspace discipline. Never was a problem there. Well....., with the exception of one time. That was an interesting situation but was quickly resolved. Don't want to discuss that.
Anyhoo, Just my 2 cent experience.
Metro
Try three 14 hour days within the last four days... I'm toast and I'm still not home yet... 
