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Viral
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Post by Viral » Fri Jul 21, 2006 7:17 am

Naval pilots use carriers all the time and they have enough trouble as it is!
Um...you're kidding right? Do you realize how often naval aviators take off from and land on carriers? And how well trained they are with it???

Do you know anything at all about naval aviation??

And though the USAF DOES have great aviators...you DO realize that the USN has some great combat aviators right??? Thats why they're able to send their pilots to NAS Fallon in Nevada. And if you dont know whats in Fallon, NV...then you dont know enough to criticize the USN.

I also didnt know that the USAF saves USN aviators in dogfights.

Just my 2 cents
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Tailhook
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Post by Tailhook » Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:29 pm

Tomcatboy48237 wrote:
lqcorsa wrote: PS: While were on the subject, are USAF pilots carrier qualified? I thought I saw a pic a while back of a F-16 w/ a tailhook.
The tailhook is used only when a fighter has an emergency, not to land on carriers.
A tailhook isn't for an emergency...why the hell would the hook be there in the first place, for carriers landings.

I have seen an F-16F with my own eyes before...it's nice but with a hook in the back ;-P. In fact I think the Navy is gonna get some F-22's, hehe Raptor with a hook that gonna look sorta weird. I know one thing is sure, I hope they don't have F-35's on a carrier, with a vertical takeoff-1. It's front heavy. 2.Hope it's not windy lol. 3.It can't carry bombs.......so basically I don't think the F-35 is going to have a good time operating since its going to be just like the 22.
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Tailhook
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Post by Tailhook » Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:35 pm

scapilot wrote:
Without the USAF, there would be no one to save the Navy in a dog fight.
Both great branches, with equally awesome planes.
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U'm alright I don't want to see this but the Super Hornet can blow away the Eagle, maybe the Strike Eagle would have a better chance but there is no equality between those two great fighters. They may have just about the same armament capabilities, but the Super Hornet F/A-18E/F has a greater targeting range and weapons system.
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Tailhook
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Post by Tailhook » Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:43 pm

Viral wrote:
Naval pilots use carriers all the time and they have enough trouble as it is!
Um...you're kidding right? Do you realize how often naval aviators take off from and land on carriers? And how well trained they are with it???

Do you know anything at all about naval aviation??

And though the USAF DOES have great aviators...you DO realize that the USN has some great combat aviators right??? Thats why they're able to send their pilots to NAS Fallon in Nevada. And if you dont know whats in Fallon, NV...then you dont know enough to criticize the USN.

Just my 2 cents
Viral, thank you for saying that. The USN saves the USAF, mostly because their the ones right there off the coast and can defend them better. The USN has better pilots mostly because they DO MORE, not to mention carrier landings 24/7. Over in Iraq, all you will see are F-16's and a few F-15's. But yet, then the USN has their whole deck clear with all the planes in the air, doing bombing runs, reconnaissance, patrol around the carrier to protection, and fighter sweeps. So yeah basically they do more, the USAF right now is doing bombing runs all over, WHILE THE USN IS JUST OVERHEAD COVERING THEM.
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STRIKER
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Post by STRIKER » Fri Jul 21, 2006 2:12 pm

All,

I suggest you re-evaluate all the USAF missions that are out there. Especially the MH-53 and MH-60 missions as well as saving AF aircrews. I have been in the helicopter side of the USAF Special Ops community for some time now and can honestly say you shouldnt ever try to get in a pissing contest to see what branch is better.....its apples and oranges...you just cant compare the two. Especially when it comes to the Fighter wars....ever stop to think that maybe the better aircraft is the one with the better pilot in it?
Viral
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Post by Viral » Fri Jul 21, 2006 5:11 pm

Yeah i agree with Striker.

I was just trying to make the point that....he was pretty misguided about the USN.
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lqcorsa
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Post by lqcorsa » Fri Jul 21, 2006 6:45 pm

CHILL CHILL EVERYBODY! Just posting a pic about the USAF carrier, and then made a joke about the USAF. Okay some people took it the wrong way and I can see how it might not ever been in my best interest to post that! I can prune the post if that's what floats your boat, but man... It was just a joke! I've grown up my hole life United States Navy, I'm a sailor boy! Come on now guys, hasn't this gotten a little bit out of hand?
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Lawndart
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Post by Lawndart » Sat Jul 22, 2006 12:37 pm

Everyone, just relax... It's apples and oranges and they are both fighting for the same team! It's the same as comparing the Blue Angels and Thunderbirds. Both excel in their own right, but complement each other, just like the Navy, Air Force, Marine and Army does for our country. Any discussions about who's better is a mute point and only shows each persons personal liking of one branch over the other.

As far as the forums. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, freedom of speech, personal taste or preference and as long as the discussions fall within the forum rules and policies set forth to keep the forums somewhat clean and professional.

Jokes, irony and sarcasm is part of our daily way of communicating in life and therefore finds its way to internet forums too. Absolutely nothing wrong with that, but just remember when posting in a forum it is often much harder to read someone's intention behind what is being said than talking to that person over the phone, if not even in person when you make use of voice, gestures, facial expressions to communicate. Forums typically don't convey the intended "pun" very well, so just something to keep in mind when posting. Other than that, just enjoy the forums and don't hold back... but remember a little common sense goes a long way!
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Post by Flip » Sun Jul 23, 2006 8:52 am

Viper101 wrote:
Tomcatboy48237 wrote:
lqcorsa wrote: PS: While were on the subject, are USAF pilots carrier qualified? I thought I saw a pic a while back of a F-16 w/ a tailhook.
The tailhook is used only when a fighter has an emergency, not to land on carriers.
A tailhook isn't for an emergency...why the hell would the hook be there in the first place, for carriers landings.
Sorry to burst a bubble here but the Tailhook found on many aircraft that serve other military branches besides the naval aviation are there to be used when the aircraft is in a situation where the aircraft has a mechanical / hydraulic failure regarding the braking system or other systems. The newest example for such an emergency was the F-111 of the royal australian airforce that had landed without gear, but had its tailhook extended and caught the wire, slowing it down frequently to a speed that is more comfortable to land without the gear out. Now you can go on about the F-111 being an offspring of the initial plan of the USN to use the F-111 on the carrier and therefore it has a tailhook, but look at the F-4 Phantom II, the Airforce (including mine) kept the Tailhook, but not to land on carriers, its there for EMERGENCY SITUATIONS! I have seen the following aircraft that have a tailhook and do not belong to a naval aviation military branch:

F-16A/B/C/D, F-4E/F Phantom II, RF-4C/E Phantom II, Panavia PA200 Tornado GR.1, GR.4, IDS, ECR, RECCE ; F-111F Aardvark.
This is just what i personally have seen.

Commenting on the argument if the USAF is better than the USN and vice versa, i think this argument should not be held because both branches complement eachother in a war scenario. Both military branches have highly trained airmen and airwomen that can fly their aircraft to the maximum of their performance. On both Sides, its not an easy job! Every man or woman that serves your country deserves the upmost respect for their distinction to serve your country! Because if you wouldnt have people like STRIKER and others , you wouldnt be having this discussion right now!

Cheers,


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Tailhook
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Post by Tailhook » Sun Jul 23, 2006 12:05 pm

omg. seriously are you guys that retarded, you can't put down the damn tailhook on the ground if you are expecting to drag and damage it by running it along the concrete runway..........the F-4 Phantom was designed to be in the USN and therefore had a hook for carrier landings,,,,,,, i swear you all gotta open your eyes and look at the navy for once. The only planes that have and did have a tailhook are the F2H Banshee, F4D Skyray, F-4B Phantom II, F-14A-D Tomcat, F/A-18A-C Hornet, F/A-18-E/F, E2 AWAC's, and a naval tanker. The USAF DOES NOT have fighter's with tailhooks therefore NO carrier landings and you can't use them for emergany's on the ground considering your already there! otherwise you drag or break them on the runway!!!!!!! USAF planes won't ever be able to land on a carrier anyways mostly because their not DESIGNED for it.
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STRIKER
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Post by STRIKER » Sun Jul 23, 2006 12:53 pm

Viper101,

I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you havent been around the AF community when you said that USAF fighters dont have tailhooks. In fact they do my friend. In fact at the end of most military runways is an arresting cable for a/c that have lost their brakes or have just failed to stop. As long as an F16 doesnt have his centerline tank he would pull the hook lever and a nitrogen blow down bottle takes care of the rest. I have actually witness this when stationed overseas. Once was a real emergency but the other time I saw it was actually to ensure the system was working fine. This time it was an F-15...did fast taxi, deployed the hook and stopped. What suprised me after that was later that day the same F-15 took off to head back home...quite a rough plane.

Here is a few links that I hope will help you with this subject:

http://www.f-16.net/f-16_forum_viewtopic-t-2012.html

http://www.f-16.net/modules.php?op=modl ... t=tailhook

http://www.f-16.net/gallery_item103628.html

I also suggest you calm down about this viper. Always keep and even cool and an open mind with the forums bud!
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Tailhook
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Post by Tailhook » Sun Jul 23, 2006 1:14 pm

yes i know, some may have a tailhook, but most don't and I know what ya mean by arrestor cables at the end of runways cause I have also seen it and I HAVE seen a plane do a crash landing before and was able to stop at the end of the way cause the rear right wheel got stuck inside. But if you look on most USAF aircraft you WONT see a tailhook. I dont really know if it depends on the model of the plane if it has a hook or not, but I have seen a few. The reason why I say barely any USAF planes have a took is because I have spent time at Dover AFB, Dulles AFB, Oceana NAS, Putuxent NAS since I live 20 mins from there. and I have only seen able 4 USAF planes ever with a hook. So to me I may not know what I am talking about and maybe I do, depending on me visually seeing it for me self for real.
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Post by Lawndart » Sun Jul 23, 2006 2:15 pm

As fighters go, the USAF has tailhook-equipped aircraft to prevent runway overruns in the event of a high-speed abort on takeoff, or brake failure on landing. Most all military fields, and a number of civilian fields (joint-use), have arresting gear strung across the runway at the ends, and various points in-between. Not only does the F-15 have a tailhook, the F-15E, F-16, F-5, F-4, F-105, F-100, F-104, F-106, all have/had tailhooks. Look closely at the pics of these planes underneath the rear fuselage. In fact, the F-117A Nighthawk has a tailhook too. However due to stealth needs, it's tailhook is located inside a door under the fuselage that opens first, and the hook drops out. The A-10 is the only USAF "fighter"-type aircraft without a tailhook.

Tailhook neatly tucked away in the belly of a F-16C.
Image

Tailhook being put to use on the arresting wire. Notice how the shape and design is distincly different from the tailhooks of aircraft performing carrier traps. These hooks are designed to drag the surface of the runway and catch the wire (even with the nosewheel down on the pavement).
Image

The Thunderbirds have tailhooks too!
Image

Almost invisible to the naked eye, unless you know where and what to look for!
Image

Who said the navy doesn't fly F-16's
The Navy in 2000 was allocated 14 F-16s (ten A models and four B models) that had originally been earmarked for Pakistan but never delivered. The aircraft are now assigned to NSAWC and have replaced the F-14s formerly assigned. The NSAWC F-16s provide our finest dissimilar Category IV threat presentations in support of Strike Fighter Advanced Readiness Program (SFARP), air-wing training at Fallon and Strike Fighter Tactics Instructor (SFTI) training evolutions.
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scapilot
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Post by scapilot » Mon Jul 24, 2006 9:22 pm

But if you look on most USAF aircraft you WONT see a tailhook. I dont really know if it depends on the model of the plane if it has a hook or not, but I have seen a few. The reason why I say barely any USAF planes have a took is because I have spent time at Dover AFB, Dulles AFB, Oceana NAS, Putuxent NAS since I live 20 mins from there. and I have only seen able 4 USAF planes ever with a hook. So to me I may not know what I am talking about and maybe I do, depending on me visually seeing it for me self for real.
omg. seriously are you guys that retarded, you can't put down the damn tailhook on the ground if you are expecting to drag and damage it by running it along the concrete runway..........the F-4 Phantom was designed to be in the USN and therefore had a hook for carrier landings,,,,,,, i swear you all gotta open your eyes and look at the navy for once. The only planes that have and did have a tailhook are the F2H Banshee, F4D Skyray, F-4B Phantom II, F-14A-D Tomcat, F/A-18A-C Hornet, F/A-18-E/F, E2 AWAC's, and a naval tanker. The USAF DOES NOT have fighter's with tailhooks therefore NO carrier landings and you can't use them for emergany's on the ground considering your already there! otherwise you drag or break them on the runway!!!!!!! USAF planes won't ever be able to land on a carrier anyways mostly because their not DESIGNED for it.

Boy, you just don't know when to keep yourself from digging do you? Do you not realize that you are being told and shown pictures by people who WORK ON THE FRIGGIN' AIRPLANES that you are swearing up and down do NOT have tailhooks? You need to lay off the Top Gun good buddy, because as you have been told twice now, they don't just use the friggin' tail hooks to arrest on board the ship. If you would pick up an approach plate, and learn to read some into this hobby that you like so much, you would start to be able to identify the arresting gear on board most air stations for just the reason that you have been told. TO PREVENT AN AIRCRAFT FROM SKIDDING DOWN THE RUNWAY. You say you saw a jet land in emergency state, but didn't use the tail hook because his gear was collapsed. Well how bout this. Not all planes land with their gear hosed up. So what about the other two million things that could possibly go wrong on the plane? And you talk about dragging the tail hook across the pavement would damage and break it? I would like to see you just sling one over your shoulder and walk about 100 yards, since you're so sure that apparently they are made out of plastic. Here's how it works. They fly a rate of descent that allows them to land just in time to SNATCH the hook, and once the hook is engaged with the arresting wire, there is no dragging it, because it rips the wire about three feet into the air until it comes to a stop. And as far as what you've seen yourself isn't saying much. Unless you work around the things all the time, who's to say that the planes you looked at weren't missing hooks because maybe they were undergoing a mod, or perhaps had to rob it to fit another jet, or the other thousands of possibilities. But you really do make yourself look extremely ignorant when you spout off about how all of us retards need to open our eyes, and realize what can and cannot happen, especially when you're two mouse clicks away from google, where you could do a little research before you come in here and make a mockery of yourself. Just my opinion. But hey, apparently you already got it all figured out.....Maverick.

P.S. Maverick, that "navy tanker" is known as an S-3B. And believe it or not, the Super Hornet will now be taking that role. Or is that not possible either? Once again, Google is free

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Flip
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Post by Flip » Tue Jul 25, 2006 5:37 pm

aww amen to that! Hoohah! Well anyways man i also stated that i knew that the F-111 and also the F-4 are aircraf that were designed for the USN but were (also) taken into USAF service.

Flip
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